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Is NSA leaker Edward Snowden a patriot or a traitor?

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(35)

Kozy62

Jun-16-13 1:55 PM

You are correct, Bob...he (VP Cheney) did say that. My concern then as now is whether someone can go too far as seems to be coming out now.

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Beaumont

Jun-16-13 10:22 AM

Dick Cheney staunchly defended the NSA surveillance programs started under his tenure as Vice President, telling Chris Wallace on Fox News Sunday that the programs could have stopped 9/11 had they been in effect, and that Edward Snowden was a traitor for revealing the information and fleeing to China.

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Kozy62

Jun-16-13 7:21 AM

Welcome to 1984 in 2013...facebook, phone call, comment or email much? You may want to review this excerpt from 1984 if you ever want to run for political office or take a stand against the government.

" Whether he went on with the diary, or whether he did not go on with it, made no difference. The Thought Police would get him just the same. He had committed— would still have committed, even if he had never set pen to paper— the essential crime that contained all others in itself. Thoughtcrime, they called it. Thoughtcrime was not a thing that could be concealed forever. You might dodge successfully for a while, even for years, but sooner or later they were bound to get you."

One might wish to believe that civil servants are apolitical ... recent IRS revelations should cause circumspection. One might be wise to stop backing this administration and demand a change.

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Kozy62

Jun-16-13 6:57 AM

Yes...

Because the same legal standards that apply to phone calls also apply to e-mail messages, text messages, and instant messages, Nadler's disclosure indicates the NSA analysts could also access the contents of Internet communications without going before a court and seeking approval.

The disclosure appears to confirm some of the allegations made by Edward Snowden, a former NSA infrastructure analyst who leaked classified documents to the Guardian. Snowden said in a video interview that, while not all NSA analysts had this ability, he could from Hawaii "wiretap anyone from you or your accountant to a federal judge to even the president."

There are serious "constitutional problems" with this approach, said Kurt Opsahl, a senior staff attorney at the Electronic Frontier Foundation who has litigated warrantless wiretapping cases. "It epitomizes the problem of secret laws."

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Kozy62

Jun-16-13 3:08 AM

I wondered when this was going to come out...

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Kozy62

Jun-16-13 3:07 AM

The National Security Agency has acknowledged in a new classified briefing that it does not need court authorization to listen to domestic phone calls.

Rep. Jerrold Nadler, a New York Democrat, disclosed this week that during a secret briefing to members of Congress, he was told that the contents of a phone call could be accessed "simply based on an analyst deciding that."

If the NSA wants "to listen to the phone," an analyst's decision is sufficient, without any other legal authorization required, Nadler said he learned. "I was rather startled," said Nadler, an attorney and congressman who serves on the House Judiciary committee.

Not only does this disclosure shed more light on how the NSA's formidable eavesdropping apparatus works domestically, it also suggests the Justice Department has secretly interpreted federal surveillance law to permit thousands of low-ranking analysts to eavesdrop on phone calls.

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Kozy62

Jun-15-13 1:05 PM

That's ok, Phoenix. Understood.

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Phoenix

Jun-15-13 9:02 AM

Apologies for misspeaking on my earlier post, Fisa wasn't set up under the Patriot Act, a provision was set up under the Patriot Act that requires the Nsa to go through Fisa.

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Phoenix

Jun-14-13 4:52 PM

That's www . npr

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Phoenix

Jun-14-13 4:50 PM

Gladly, since you obviously haven't heard of Fisa, The Secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court. Following is a link to the original Guardian article and two more links just for fun. m.guardiannews. com /.../nsa-phone-recor... ****npr. org/.../nsa-collecting-v... talkingpointsmemo. com/.../revealed-nsa-...

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Kozy62

Jun-14-13 3:29 PM

Now, truly...I don't believe that anyone who is posting here is anti-American or would, on purpose, hurt our Republic.

I do believe the current administration is having far too many issues with trust. I believe that is why so many are anti the taking of our information. Check the voting records on the Patriot act and you find almost everyone from liberal to conservative wanted this law. Can it be abused? Can it be used against us? Should "we the people" let our guards down no matter what political party holds the WH?

Now again, I believe it is wrong to give way secrets and it looks like this young man has...I just want to see what the facts are. Is that too much to want?

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Kozy62

Jun-14-13 3:20 PM

No, rentss, Phoenix, and Bob...Unlike others I know, I have voted for the person rather than only a republican. have certain values that can sway my vote but I spend a great deal of time making certain I vote for the candidate who seems best for the country. I enjoy debate and don't unfriend or un-follow a person because they are politically bent different than me. I also do not call names as that ruins any real debate.

You see, I'm not perfect and on some things you may be right (although rarely). And' if I agree with you I let it be known.

What I don't like is lying and false statements and there are far too many being bantered around. Please don't post something just because it was on MSNBC or Breitbart or Fox because they can be wrong. Check at least three sources from all directions ad then post...makes for a great debate my friends.

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rentss

Jun-14-13 11:32 AM

Oh no, Notsocialist, I see things quite clearly. And no, you don't really support this country. You support conservatives, but when you see someone who you think will prove embarrassing for a Democratic president, you'll immediately side even with a traitor. All you care about is the GOP.

It's the same with Kozy, he's just more educated and less extremist.

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Phoenix

Jun-14-13 9:49 AM

First of all notSocialist, like it or not President Obama went through the proper channels and received a subpoena from the special court set up under the Patriot Act. Secondly, whatever gave you the impression that I support it under this adminstration? I've never supported it, most progressives don't, if you don't believe me check out msnbc, not a bunch of happy campers over there. Now, isn't it time you quit stalling and answer my question?

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Beaumont

Jun-13-13 8:04 PM

Harry Potter here Great post rentss.

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Kozy62

Jun-13-13 7:05 PM

Rentss, whether you choose to believe or not has only an effect on you. If you read my posts on the subject, I said that I would like to find out more information before I would take a final position. I don't see what's wrong with that. What that has to do with the republican party is beyond me.

Maybe it would be best to slow down, check facts, read what's posted carefully and take a pill.

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rentss

Jun-13-13 5:11 PM

I really have no idea what Notsocialist is talking about.

One thing that's clear is that both Kozy and Notsocialist care far more about the GOP than they do the country. That's the only explanation for their embracing a traitor who has also evidently leaked info about spying on China.

No offense, Kozy, but I'm not christian. Bible verses are about as important to me as paragraphs from a Harry Potter novel.

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Phoenix

Jun-13-13 1:00 PM

Never said Obama was perfect, but does he represent my principles better then Bush, yes. He's yet to invade a foreign nation, he's pushed for health care reform, equal rights for gays and women, and immigration reform, credit to Bush, he went against his party and also pushed for immigration reform. We no longer torture terror suspects or listen in on Americans phone conversations through warrantless wire taps.

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rpmwwe

Jun-13-13 12:15 PM

"Not making excuses rpmwwe, ...."

I'm not suggesting the Patriot Act was altogether good as it certainly had some questionable elements. What I am pointing out is the hypocrisy of Obama who ran his campaign on being the opposite of Bush. Remember all the "transparency" his administration was going to have? If Obama is going to be just as shady, if not more, as Bush, then its going to be difficult to make an argument that Obama represents your principles better than Bush.

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Beaumont

Jun-13-13 7:17 AM

notSocialist Your last two post. What the*****does that have to do with anything? You are off the road again.

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Kozy62

Jun-12-13 8:29 AM

The way of a fool seems right to him, but a wise man listens to advice. Proverbs 12:15

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Kozy62

Jun-12-13 8:04 AM

I believe, rents, you'll find that most "thoughtful" people want to know more before they just hang either person.

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rentss

Jun-11-13 6:46 PM

Funny how low-information conservatives were ready to hang Bradley Manning, but see no problem with Snowden.

They're both traitors, and both should be hanged ASAP.

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Phoenix

Jun-11-13 6:00 PM

Not making excuses rpmwwe, just pointing out the hypocrisy of conservatives who had no problem with the authority the Patriot Act gave to the executive branch under the last administration but do under the present one.

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ladybug

Jun-11-13 2:15 PM

Bush is not out like it or not .His BS hasa carried over into the next Presidencie,

We'll be paying for alot of his screw ups for decades, Namely a war that was unwarrented

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